Still don’t think its quite ready but its chugging along and its been fun following the progress. I know they have some big updates inbound. Hopefully people actually give it a shot and flip over to Fluxer.
I’d also add that the “Proton” subscrition equivalent - “Plutonium”, is a better value proposition. But I will admit, they still need to clear a few hurdles before even I feel completely comfortable ditching Discord.
But its Open Source and it has a self-hosting option, along with the Quality of Life you expect from Discord in terms of the app layout, screen sharing, etc.
Open source is the way. It always amuses me when people move from one proprietary system to a different one, since the new one always ends up having the same issues.
That’s why I think we should start teaching FOSS Linux as the first operating systems Kids are exposed to. It’s neutral ground in the sense that no one company owns and controls it, and the things they learn will help them understand why things are the way they are, not just what the latest marketing-hype “feature” is.
Someone I know went to a university that ran off Linux and I’m jealous of the comprehensive Linux 101 they got. It took me years to learn some of that stuff.
The new one usually won’t have the same issues at first, but they’ll have the same opportunities and motivations that lead to the issues. People will see a different provider and say they’re not doing the bad things, and they’ll be correct for a few years maybe, but then it becomes a struggle to get them to switch to the next thing. This whole problem would mostly be solved with open-source alternatives instead.
The thing with age verification is that it’s a legal requirement, so they’re all going to have to do it.
Running an online service with a lot of users is very expensive, too. All these proprietary services eventually realise that they need revenue in order to continue operating. That’s one of the reasons why decentralized, federated services are the way to go - everyone runs their own small community, so there’s no one company or person that has to cover an enormous bill.
This commit was the refactor commit from the private dev flow to the open source repo. The process basically added a lot of files and deleted a bunch as well. it was long overdue but I wouldn’t expect constant 11m line code changes
You really don’t understand what 11m lines of code is. Only a collective of humans over many years can create 11m lines of code. It is an absolute batshit insane amout of code.
yea 11m changes is quite a bit at once but, I wouldn’t expect a constant change like that. After all, the monorepo itself is a little over 3m lines, 1.37m of it being lang/locale files for every language for its front end, 600k of it is comments, and 1.5m is the rest of it.
Wow, I thought the actual functional part was around 1m. I am going to check the loc to see if it makes sense in my second language, LLMs are pretty consistent on their translation errors.
Not necessarily. Huge additions without matching deletions often happen during restructurings like vendorizing dependencies, importing external packages, generating bindings, or migrating private repos into a monorepo. In these cases new code canbbe introduced to repository and there will be no corresponding deletions in commit history.
I’ve did similar restructurings myself, eg. Making automatically generated resources static
You have no idea what 11 million likes of code is do you? LibreOffice is 11m, Android is 12m, MySQL is 10m. Those projects took years to code not 9 months. I am going to have to ask you to stay in your lane, and I pray that is not Software Engineering.
I’m not sure why you’re being so hostile, but you’re fundamentally confusing a codebase’s hand-written LoC with Git commit additions.
Nobody is saying someone authored 11M lines. Commit fa3e8525 was a workspace reconciliation - importing external repository code, dependencies, and assets into the public repo for the first time, so exactly the type of thing I was talking about. Git counts all imported lines as additions.
Before asking others to “stay in their lane”, maybe make sure you understand how Git history handles repository imports and dependency tracking. Have a good day.
and also isn’t a discord alternative to begin with
It absolutely is. A “Space” is the equivalent to a Discord “server”. It’s not perfect and polished, but it does the job. I’ve been using it rather than Discord with my gaming group for a year now.
I wouldn’t call it a shit show, they were first in E2E encrypted collaborative messaging platforms and get all the hits.
Moderation turned out to be incompatible with E2E encryption. People kicked out of channels can still decrypt because keys revocation hasn’t been made.
Matrix server is a resource hog and a mess, and the protocol has never took off to spark alternative implementations.
Encryption doesn’t scale well for big channels.
They got many things right, but got crippled by many things they couldn’t possibly predict.
I’ve been eyeing Fluxer for quite a while now. Once they roll out the update where they want to overhaul and streamline the selfhosting part, my friends and I are going to switch
Look at the git and tell me. One guy, contributing 1.5m lines of code is not human made. It’s a matter of time before it falls apart and becomes unmaintainable.
It’s not, people are objectively being retarded about this. They merged in the actual prod code base from the closed private repo that had the entire small team working on it for months. Into the open source public repo when as the first major refactor and functionally went from preview build to first real public beta.
A few million lines of code from a small team and a number of one of contributors over months of work on a brand new project is perfectly god damn normal.
The repo went from elevator pitch to real product in one go cause the work had been done else where.
Two commits today, presumably after this merge you talk about, +12k, -27k. In one day. You think humans can do that? Yesterday, 22 commits and I opened a random one: +15k, -9k. Just put this supposed human effort into an actual standard like Matrix instead of vibing your own.
Shout out to Fluxer.
Still don’t think its quite ready but its chugging along and its been fun following the progress. I know they have some big updates inbound. Hopefully people actually give it a shot and flip over to Fluxer.
I’d also add that the “Proton” subscrition equivalent - “Plutonium”, is a better value proposition. But I will admit, they still need to clear a few hurdles before even I feel completely comfortable ditching Discord.
But its Open Source and it has a self-hosting option, along with the Quality of Life you expect from Discord in terms of the app layout, screen sharing, etc.
Open source is the way. It always amuses me when people move from one proprietary system to a different one, since the new one always ends up having the same issues.
That’s why I think we should start teaching FOSS Linux as the first operating systems Kids are exposed to. It’s neutral ground in the sense that no one company owns and controls it, and the things they learn will help them understand why things are the way they are, not just what the latest marketing-hype “feature” is.
Someone I know went to a university that ran off Linux and I’m jealous of the comprehensive Linux 101 they got. It took me years to learn some of that stuff.
The new one usually won’t have the same issues at first, but they’ll have the same opportunities and motivations that lead to the issues. People will see a different provider and say they’re not doing the bad things, and they’ll be correct for a few years maybe, but then it becomes a struggle to get them to switch to the next thing. This whole problem would mostly be solved with open-source alternatives instead.
The thing with age verification is that it’s a legal requirement, so they’re all going to have to do it.
Running an online service with a lot of users is very expensive, too. All these proprietary services eventually realise that they need revenue in order to continue operating. That’s one of the reasons why decentralized, federated services are the way to go - everyone runs their own small community, so there’s no one company or person that has to cover an enormous bill.
No.
Holy fuck!
hmm I thought they leaned relatively against AI slop. Wouldn’t this be because they were working on it privately or something for quite some time?
It’s 11 million lines of fucking code. 11 MILLION LINES.
This commit was the refactor commit from the private dev flow to the open source repo. The process basically added a lot of files and deleted a bunch as well. it was long overdue but I wouldn’t expect constant 11m line code changes
You really don’t understand what 11m lines of code is. Only a collective of humans over many years can create 11m lines of code. It is an absolute batshit insane amout of code.
yea 11m changes is quite a bit at once but, I wouldn’t expect a constant change like that. After all, the monorepo itself is a little over 3m lines, 1.37m of it being lang/locale files for every language for its front end, 600k of it is comments, and 1.5m is the rest of it.
Wow, I thought the actual functional part was around 1m. I am going to check the loc to see if it makes sense in my second language, LLMs are pretty consistent on their translation errors.
It’s obviously some kind of code reorganization, restructuring or reformating, don’t be paranoid
A refactoring would have a relatively similar number of subtractions as additions. This is almost entirely additions. This is not just refactoring.
Not necessarily. Huge additions without matching deletions often happen during restructurings like vendorizing dependencies, importing external packages, generating bindings, or migrating private repos into a monorepo. In these cases new code canbbe introduced to repository and there will be no corresponding deletions in commit history.
I’ve did similar restructurings myself, eg. Making automatically generated resources static
You have no idea what 11 million likes of code is do you? LibreOffice is 11m, Android is 12m, MySQL is 10m. Those projects took years to code not 9 months. I am going to have to ask you to stay in your lane, and I pray that is not Software Engineering.
I’m not sure why you’re being so hostile, but you’re fundamentally confusing a codebase’s hand-written LoC with Git commit additions.
Nobody is saying someone authored 11M lines. Commit fa3e8525 was a workspace reconciliation - importing external repository code, dependencies, and assets into the public repo for the first time, so exactly the type of thing I was talking about. Git counts all imported lines as additions.
Before asking others to “stay in their lane”, maybe make sure you understand how Git history handles repository imports and dependency tracking. Have a good day.
Yeah, some projects also ditch external dependencies to make their own
Shout out to Matrix, which is federated, self hostable, open source, and supports end to end encryption.
Matrix is a bit of a shit show and also isn’t a discord alternative to begin with.
Matrix is a Discord alternative, but not a Discord clone
How so?
It absolutely is. A “Space” is the equivalent to a Discord “server”. It’s not perfect and polished, but it does the job. I’ve been using it rather than Discord with my gaming group for a year now.
I’ve been using Matrix for over a decade now. How is it a shitshow?
I wouldn’t call it a shit show, they were first in E2E encrypted collaborative messaging platforms and get all the hits. Moderation turned out to be incompatible with E2E encryption. People kicked out of channels can still decrypt because keys revocation hasn’t been made.
Matrix server is a resource hog and a mess, and the protocol has never took off to spark alternative implementations.
Encryption doesn’t scale well for big channels.
They got many things right, but got crippled by many things they couldn’t possibly predict.
I had never used Matrix outside direct messaging so I was unaware of the lack of key revocation.
The entire concept of it is a shit show. It’s the prime example of anti user design.
It’s a functional system, with the entire concept of user friendly design and non power user being ignored.
It’s made by power users and engineers for power users and engineers. It’s fantastic for what it is.
I’ve been eyeing Fluxer for quite a while now. Once they roll out the update where they want to overhaul and streamline the selfhosting part, my friends and I are going to switch
It’s a slop project.
Is this substantiated?
At this point for many projects it’s now depressingly, a matter of degree.
Look at the git and tell me. One guy, contributing 1.5m lines of code is not human made. It’s a matter of time before it falls apart and becomes unmaintainable.
It’s not, people are objectively being retarded about this. They merged in the actual prod code base from the closed private repo that had the entire small team working on it for months. Into the open source public repo when as the first major refactor and functionally went from preview build to first real public beta.
A few million lines of code from a small team and a number of one of contributors over months of work on a brand new project is perfectly god damn normal.
The repo went from elevator pitch to real product in one go cause the work had been done else where.
Two commits today, presumably after this merge you talk about, +12k, -27k. In one day. You think humans can do that? Yesterday, 22 commits and I opened a random one: +15k, -9k. Just put this supposed human effort into an actual standard like Matrix instead of vibing your own.