Every adult citizen gets an electronic ID card. Said smartcard let’s you authenticate on government websites (FIDO2). And maybe it could sign your vote for referendums if that’s possible in your country. Every smartcard would be secured with a PIN code.
It also can create an anonymous “adult cryptographic token” to register on adult sites, gambling sites and social networks.
Parents could create a token for their childs but they take responsibility for any illegal use, for example in this case using social networks below 16 years old.
Edit : This seems to already be a project in the EU with the EUDI Wallet. It is supposed to start deployment before the end of 2026. Too bad the UK left the EU, this EUDI wallet has features to prove anonymously that you are an adult…
Now what really will happen is politics will say “think of the children” and use that opportunity for more surveillance of their population.
It’s too bad technical problems are answered by politicians and not engineers. We are also very late in term of digital ID cards. Everybody should have for free the means to authenticate online and do so anonymously when needed. We live in a digital world, we need the tools to evolve in it.
It is imperative you can vote without others knowing how you voted (at least here in the UK…). Electronic voting is inferrior to paper when it comes to trustworthness of recording an anonymous vote, counting the result and preventing mass vote fraud.
We already have a hardcopy ID to travel internationally or ID to drive vehicles. The risks of an electronic ID being easily copied would have to get me visiting other solar systems or driving a time machine before I considered it. Something tells me the paper options would continue working at first but eventually this idea will be forced on people.
I was led to believe people on Lemmy are more technically minded. So can you explain to me how you don’t think the government has the technical capabilities to already monitor internet usage of its citizens? The DWP can already access your internet history if they suspect benefit fraud already, for example…
Then what is the problem with the bill? Everyone is up in arms about censorship and monitoring their identity but that already happens. This bill just means it’s harder for kids to access garbage sites? The capabilities to do all the things people think this bill will achieve already do exist in any case…
As my comment said, I’m not against the ban of kids accessing social networks. But I’m against age verification laws that are not protecting anonymity which is in my opinion the logical next step for politicians.
My comment is very much explaining why I want people to be able to verify their age anonymously.
And no, just because governments surveil their population doesn’t mean we should make it even easier with privacy invading age verification laws.
And my point is you have already lost the ability of privacy long ago…
Anonymous age verification? You are not anonymous on the internet to begin with. Even doing what you’ve suggested won’t reduce the ability for the government and even data brokers to identify you.
If you think using Linux, encryption, vpns and Lemmy makes you anonymous to any states or data brokers that want to identify you then you are naive at best.
I have not surrendered my anonymity, I recognised and accepted that in order to have it, a lot of bad things become possible, and the damage it causes… It’s just not worth.
That’s an entirely different subject though, my point remains. You are not anonymous to governments or data brokers. This bill won’t decrease your level of privacy, it will only make it more difficult for children to access social media, which currently is plagued with all sorts of harmful content. This bill is a net positive.
How about we make the web safe for everyone. There is no need for gambling and other harmful things, as it impacts everyone - this isnt an age problem.
This isn’t only a technical problem, but also an human rights, and youth rights problem. And right now, that anonymous I’d thing will only punish the people the most while corporations publishing harmful algorithms stay blameless.
So free reign for censorship so long as someone alleges harm?
So in your mind protecting people from proven harms is censorship? Isnt this what you essentially are advocating for here?
Side note, censorship is not what I advocate for, but a free internet thats safe for everyone. If regulation is censorship then you clearly need to look up the definitions.
Here is how I wish we would solve this problem :
Every adult citizen gets an electronic ID card. Said smartcard let’s you authenticate on government websites (FIDO2). And maybe it could sign your vote for referendums if that’s possible in your country. Every smartcard would be secured with a PIN code.
It also can create an anonymous “adult cryptographic token” to register on adult sites, gambling sites and social networks.
Parents could create a token for their childs but they take responsibility for any illegal use, for example in this case using social networks below 16 years old.
Edit : This seems to already be a project in the EU with the EUDI Wallet. It is supposed to start deployment before the end of 2026. Too bad the UK left the EU, this EUDI wallet has features to prove anonymously that you are an adult…
Now what really will happen is politics will say “think of the children” and use that opportunity for more surveillance of their population.
It’s too bad technical problems are answered by politicians and not engineers. We are also very late in term of digital ID cards. Everybody should have for free the means to authenticate online and do so anonymously when needed. We live in a digital world, we need the tools to evolve in it.
It is imperative you can vote without others knowing how you voted (at least here in the UK…). Electronic voting is inferrior to paper when it comes to trustworthness of recording an anonymous vote, counting the result and preventing mass vote fraud.
We already have a hardcopy ID to travel internationally or ID to drive vehicles. The risks of an electronic ID being easily copied would have to get me visiting other solar systems or driving a time machine before I considered it. Something tells me the paper options would continue working at first but eventually this idea will be forced on people.
I was led to believe people on Lemmy are more technically minded. So can you explain to me how you don’t think the government has the technical capabilities to already monitor internet usage of its citizens? The DWP can already access your internet history if they suspect benefit fraud already, for example…
Never said or even implied that.
Then what is the problem with the bill? Everyone is up in arms about censorship and monitoring their identity but that already happens. This bill just means it’s harder for kids to access garbage sites? The capabilities to do all the things people think this bill will achieve already do exist in any case…
“The negative things people are upset about already happen, so we should be fine with those things being made easier and happening more.”
As my comment said, I’m not against the ban of kids accessing social networks. But I’m against age verification laws that are not protecting anonymity which is in my opinion the logical next step for politicians.
My comment is very much explaining why I want people to be able to verify their age anonymously.
And no, just because governments surveil their population doesn’t mean we should make it even easier with privacy invading age verification laws.
And my point is you have already lost the ability of privacy long ago…
Anonymous age verification? You are not anonymous on the internet to begin with. Even doing what you’ve suggested won’t reduce the ability for the government and even data brokers to identify you.
Talk about yourself.
You might have surrendered but many have not.
I’m on linux, extensively use encryption, I’m not on any social network beside Lemmy, so I strongly disagree that anonymity is dead online.
That confirms you didn’t read my comment.
EUID has exactly the feature I’m describing in my post. Being able to prove your an adult without divulging your identity.
If you think using Linux, encryption, vpns and Lemmy makes you anonymous to any states or data brokers that want to identify you then you are naive at best.
I have not surrendered my anonymity, I recognised and accepted that in order to have it, a lot of bad things become possible, and the damage it causes… It’s just not worth.
That’s an entirely different subject though, my point remains. You are not anonymous to governments or data brokers. This bill won’t decrease your level of privacy, it will only make it more difficult for children to access social media, which currently is plagued with all sorts of harmful content. This bill is a net positive.
Believe what you want.
But don’t point your finger toward people that do their best to maximize their privacy.
How about we make the web safe for everyone. There is no need for gambling and other harmful things, as it impacts everyone - this isnt an age problem.
This isn’t only a technical problem, but also an human rights, and youth rights problem. And right now, that anonymous I’d thing will only punish the people the most while corporations publishing harmful algorithms stay blameless.
So free reign for censorship so long as someone alleges harm?
So in your mind protecting people from proven harms is censorship? Isnt this what you essentially are advocating for here?
Side note, censorship is not what I advocate for, but a free internet thats safe for everyone. If regulation is censorship then you clearly need to look up the definitions.